Athena 70ccm vs. Polini 65ccm

Waldi1 · Post by **Waldi1** » Tue 24 Nov 2009, 23:01

Hello,
I am new in this forum and sorry that i write in English but i am form Austria so i think english is better than German.

Can you say me which Kit is better for the Camino. Which hp (ps or kw) can i reach with this kit? Do i have to change the caburetor? If I use the 21mm which hp can i reache than?
The speed is not so important but i need more acceleration.

Do you know whitch kit Carlos or Carlito has?

Thank you, Walter!

killingsnake · Post by **killingsnake** » Tue 24 Nov 2009, 23:17

Welcome to Camino-tuning

English is indeed a lot better than German.
I don't have hp values to give you, since there is a LOT that can be improved on a camino, such as carburation, exhaust, transmission and etc. Maybe you can start measuring BHP and than improve from there, I don't know what kind of experience you have with 2-stroke engines.

If you want raw power, you can start from the Athena 70ccm kit. It has a larger bore, and is made of aluminium (with nicasil coating on the inside) and the piston only has 1 piston ring.

But if you get one, inspect the cilinder from the inside. The finish of the ports tend to be pretty bad, but if you take care of that it's a great cilinder.

The polini is also good though, and can take more km's than the athena, but i have the feeling you don't care about that to much?

clio-tuning · Post by **clio-tuning** » Wed 25 Nov 2009, 05:12

Moved to the english section

duf · Post by **duf** » Wed 25 Nov 2009, 06:55

There is no doubt that you should go for the Athena cylinder.
First of al its an aloy and not an iron one.

And in fact, this is probably the best cilinder ever made for the camino.
But you should get that cilinder tuned (local tuner).
With a good vario setup and a good carburettor (21mm)
you should be able to reach 10-12hp!

And if you want to make it last a bit,
get some good oil, and use the highest octane pump fuel available.
In that way you'll get a sligt better result and les chance in detonation (due to the higher octane level)

Hope this helps you on your way for your choice

Waldi1 · Post by **Waldi1** » Wed 25 Nov 2009, 14:41

Thanks for the quick answer!

That sounds really good. I hoped that i will get about 5hp. But all what i get more is perfect.

Really? The Athena has nicasil coating on the inside? But if i correct the ports tend, could it be that i will damage the nicasil coating?

I want to order 4-8 main jets for the malossi 21mm. But which size should i order that i can optimice the engine?

Should i also change the membran in carbon? or is it not so important?

Which mixed fuel can i use with the Athena? 1:50

Thanks!

duf · Post by **duf** » Wed 25 Nov 2009, 20:21

every alloy cylinder has a nicasil coating inside it (alloy isn't hard enough to run a piston on)
When correcting/adjusting the ports, it can come loose,
but when it's done well and not overdone it won't let loosse.

Jet sized depends on how much air you give it.
But wi don't have any experience with the malossi kit (with that extra air filter)
Stock jet should be 78-86
With more air like an open air filter it can go up to 120-130

That just come's down to testing,
wich can be alot of work, but it is the best learning course

killingsnake · Post by **killingsnake** » Wed 25 Nov 2009, 21:37

Don't you mean 'aluminum' duf? And i had a discussion lately that aluminum cilinders exist with a hard chrome coating on the inside, not nicasil..

You use chrome piston rings with a nicasil coated cilinder, so i can imagine people could mix the terms, but do you know if hard chrome coated cilinders exist?

@waldi

the nicasil is very hard, but because of that its very brittle. The chance does exist that pieces break of, but thats the risk of tuning i guess.

And as duf said, noone can tell you the exact jet size. What you can do is order a (few) small one(s), and with a jet drill set you can make the jet bigger yourself. If you go to big, you can take another one and make it the size the engine runned well on.

Or you can order allot of jets and test them all out? It does depend allot on the kind of air filter you use, as duf said.

If you use good oil, 1:50 is fine (in my eyes, absolute minimum for "enhanced" moped motors), but the engine would run well on 1:25, and that's allot more oil.

Membranes: your performance won't improve (maybe a bit, like: only noticable on a test bench(?)), but the chance exists, even with standard engines, that the membranes break. If they do, they wreak havok inside your engine. Carbon reeds will just splinter and won't do any(/as much) damage.

duf · Post by **duf** » Thu 26 Nov 2009, 07:00

Yes i know that there are cylinders with a hard crome coating, but not for camino

about the oil, 1:50 should be good,
if you're unsure then go 1:45 or 40.

But 25 is alot, and the more oil, the less power you'll have

About the membranes, if you're on stock carburettor then just get some carbon reeds,
(take the polini ones they are very durable)

If you're going for a larger carburettor let's say the 21mm kit.
You should adjust the membrame,
Adjust it for flow and make it a bit bigger.
This is something that you will notice

Waldi1 · Post by **Waldi1** » Sat 28 Nov 2009, 19:13

Great!

Thank you for all information!
I will test it.

Walti

HondaCaminoTuning.be

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