Mer Eur kit and water cooling

klainstain · Post by **klainstain** » Sun 26 Jul 2009, 19:21

killingsnake wrote:Klopt.. Als ie het in zijn bedrijf zelf kan doen dikke kans van wel.. Maar bij een prive persoon thuis? Héél dikke kans van niet... Argon is quasi niet te betalen en als je het koopt moet je bvb ineens een contract voor 2 jaar ofzo tekenen...

Maar ik woon op een industriepark, dus mn overgebuur is wel degelijk een bedrijf met personeel enzo

Kzal eens informeren

FertBert · Post by **FertBert** » Sun 26 Jul 2009, 20:27

So I guess not many of you have access to welders? I didn't think that would be much of an issue. I personally don't have a welder but have a few friends around town who have access to shops that do have welders. How much is a tank of Argon in Europe?

As for getting the case to match up with the cylinder I don't plan on welding anything. In the U.S. we have JB weld...

I imagine you guys have something similar. It dries almost as hard as aluminum, you can even thread it! So I plan to use that to get more material on the case. A lot of people here do this when they put 75cc Metra kits on their Puch mopeds.

To get the exhaust on you may need to do some welding. The angle of the port is different than a standard Hobbit kit and like I said, it might be easier to use a Puch or Peugeot exhaust pipe.

I doubt it will cost me $500. The kit was only $125, I found a radiator for $40 and a polini pump for $60. It's going to take some time to put together, I will let you know when it's done.

Oh yeah, you guys might like this. Here's a bike I built a little bit ago, enjoy...

killingsnake · Post by **killingsnake** » Sun 26 Jul 2009, 21:01

On your blog you posted a picture of blue moped, polini blue with a polini sticker on the tank.. Do you have any more information about it? I like it alot!

This one is very nice to

!

Which tank did you use on it?
Any further plans with the space underneath it?

FertBert · Post by **FertBert** » Sun 26 Jul 2009, 21:11

I used a Puch Magnum tank. I don' think those bikes were imported to Europe. It's like the Puch Monza but a little smaller.

The blue bike is a friend of mine's named Phil. Here's a post on his blog about the bike...
http://mopedhq.blogspot.com/search?q=swinger
And here's a pretty good picture of him on it...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/14152239@N02/2900351219/

klainstain · Post by **klainstain** » Sun 26 Jul 2009, 23:00

I like it very much

It looks a bit like an Honda mb. (correct me if i'm wrong) but I like it

Twister · Post by **Twister** » Mon 27 Jul 2009, 09:49

FertBert wrote:So I guess not many of you have access to welders? I didn't think that would be much of an issue. I personally don't have a welder but have a few friends around town who have access to shops that do have welders. How much is a tank of Argon in Europe?

It will not be very difficult to find a welder, but it will probably cost me the salary of around one hour workmanship… (it will be cheaper when a friend can do this for me

).

FertBert wrote:As for getting the case to match up with the cylinder I don't plan on welding anything. In the U.S. we have JB weld...
I imagine you guys have something similar. It dries almost as hard as aluminum, you can even thread it! So I plan to use that to get more material on the case. A lot of people here do this when they put 75cc Metra kits on their Puch mopeds.

Well, I used both Devcon C1 and Pattex Liquid Metal (which I assume are both similar products). The first mentioned is quite expensive (€70 for half a liter) but works really well and is resists high temperatures. Pattex Liquid Metal is cheap but not well enough resistant to high temperatures. After hardening, with both it is possible to thread it.
But still, it wouldn’t be enough for me, I would choose for more security and weld it, like it’s done on this picture:

FertBert wrote:To get the exhaust on you may need to do some welding. The angle of the port is different than a standard Hobbit kit and like I said, it might be easier to use a Puch or Peugeot exhaust pipe.

Isn’t the cylinder of a Yamaha Jog horizontal placed (so the direction of the piston is horizontal)? If it is, it shouldn’t be a big problem to chose a nice cylinder for the Yamaha (like this or this)?

FertBert wrote:I doubt it will cost me $500. The kit was only $125, I found a radiator for $40 and a polini pump for $60. It's going to take some time to put together, I will let you know when it's done.

Maybe I should have said ‘It will cost me…’

. As far as I know, a new radiator and pump will cost me at least €150. The cylinder will cost me more then €100. I need a (new exhaust (another €100) and then there is still work to do (like welding or using devcon) which will not be for free…
After two years intensively making Camino-project, I know that I’ve always been to optimistic in calculating the costs… so now I make more conservative estimations…

But, now you’ve triggered me… Maybe I make a LC-kit like that fit on my cross-project…

FertBert wrote:Oh yeah, you guys might like this. Here's a bike I built a little bit ago, enjoy...

Wonderful!

That’s is a really great creation of a Camino! Very well done!

Twister · Post by **Twister** » Mon 27 Jul 2009, 10:21

killingsnake wrote:I was talking about the AC cylinder . Looks to me that's 'just' a DR cylinder. No worries about the durability, but is isn't one of the top performers out there. The site selling them overrates them quite a bit if you ask me...

Well, I'm not sure whether it's a copy of a DR, but it seems like it...

@FertBert: Did you actually get what you ordered? While on your picture I can see the piston with two pistonrings (a DR piston has got two pistonrings), but on the picture in the link you posted, the piston has only one ring.

At first sight, it seems like the distance between the top of the cylinder and the top of the transferport of the Mer Eur cylinder is different than the distance between the top of a DR cylinder and the transferports. If that is indeed the case, the Mer Eur cylinder is likely to gave max power at a different RPM than the DR.

@FertBert, Perhaps you could make a portmap of that Mer Eur cylinder, than we can compare it with the one I posted...

Mr.Gti · Post by **Mr.Gti** » Mon 27 Jul 2009, 21:59

sorry to say .but thats not a DR racing cylinder ..its some no name cylinder .. dr racing has 50 ccm cylinders and 70 ccm cylinder for thoes scooter models >>>>>>>.and yes its true it fits from a MINA BLOCK ..and its Yamaha aerox aprilia sonic .yamaha jog as/fs

Mr.Gti · Post by **Mr.Gti** » Mon 27 Jul 2009, 22:05

and as second the dr racing evoulution 70 ccm is 47 mm cylinder and its a sport cylinder kit =)

Twister · Post by **Twister** » Mon 27 Jul 2009, 23:20

Mr.Gti wrote:sorry to say .but thats not a DR racing cylinder ..its some no name cylinder .. dr racing has 50 ccm cylinders and 70 ccm cylinder for thoes scooter models >>>>>>>.and yes its true it fits from a MINA BLOCK ..and its Yamaha aerox aprilia sonic .yamaha jog as/fs

I guess we have a little misunderstanding... I don't understand to which post you refer...

The DR we are talking about is this one (for Camino):
http://www.espower.nl/product_info.php/ ... s_id/13116
As far as I know, is this the only one for Camino, and it has a 46 bore (so 65cc);

We were comparing this DR for Camino with the one FertBert is showing:
https://www.1977mopeds.com/product/1523 ... inder-Kit/
According to that webshop, it has also a 46 bore (so again 65cc).

So although it hasn't the same name, we thought perhaps it is a copy of a DR-cylinder... At least I've never heard of a Mer Eur cylinder in the Netherlands...

Or, Mr.Gti, did you refer the LC kit mentioned by FertBert in the first post?
http://www.scooterworks.com/NCY_Cylinde ... _P6674.cfm

Because for this one it's obvious that it ain't a DR cylinder (in the webshop it says it is a "NCY Cylinder w/Head, 47mm - Jog 50 LC"

)

Mr.Gti wrote:and as second the dr racing evoulution 70 ccm is 47 mm cylinder and its a sport cylinder kit =)

I guess you refer again to cylinders for Yamaha Jog, not for Camino.

FertBert · Post by **FertBert** » Mon 27 Jul 2009, 23:40

Ok, I made a port map of the cylinder I have. It has a dual ring piston, I'm not sure why the link I posted has a different piston.

The exhaust port seems to be a little bit more aggressive than the one on the DR. I also calculated the area of the boost/transfer ports on the Mer Eur kit and the DR.

DR = 434 mm squared area
Mer Eur = 556 mm squared area

This is probably due to the fact that the bore or size of the Mer Eur kit is slightly bigger than the DR.

Mr.Gti · Post by **Mr.Gti** » Tue 28 Jul 2009, 09:42

sorry yes i missunderstand this topic .. i tougt they were telling about that yamaha cylinder that it was dr racing cylinder hehe ..but now i understand =)

Mr.Gti · Post by **Mr.Gti** » Tue 28 Jul 2009, 09:43

but one thing ...they yamaha jog stroke length is shorter then the camino

klainstain · Post by **klainstain** » Tue 28 Jul 2009, 10:29

Is it an vlinderpoort? (butterflyexhausport

)
Or just a line ?

Twister · Post by **Twister** » Tue 28 Jul 2009, 10:38

klainstain wrote:Is it an vlinderpoort? (butterflyexhausport )
Or just a line ?

No, it's not a "butterflyexhaustport" (mooi gevonden trouwens

). I it's called bridged port in English, and it looks like this:

Vlinderpoort.jpg

HondaCaminoTuning.be

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